Understanding Battle Mechanics 101

[Fester]

1000 snipers do 80*1000 damage or 80k damage to the defending VBs who have 2500*150 life or 375,000 total life, reducing their health to 295,000 total life.

**Important Note** When a troop attacks another troop type, the entire attacking troops hit the same target and the damage dealt is spread evenly among all of the troop type that was hit. Troops will not start to die, until after 50% of their total life has been reduced.

Please explain with more details.

1. Why did you remark here about _another_ troop type? What happens when a troop attacks the same troop type?

2. And how exactly compute amount of survived units?

10 units have 1000 life total.

After first round units received 400 damage. Still 10 troops remain, but 600 life total? A next turn brings 150 damage. How much units will survive? And most interesting, third turn. If survived 5 units with 450 life total, how to compute result of this last turn? If this turn brings 60 damage whether one unit die or not? Perhaps not cuz total amount of life now is 500 and 450 - 60 still more then half of total life?


3. Which troops will be attacked if more then one troop type stay in the same position under fire? What happens after first turn here:

Snipers (1000).....firing distance.....Snipers (1) + Sigbins (1)

who will die after this turn, all or only one troop type?

4. Move + attack during a turn. Does it matter the amount of remaining speed points after moving on amount of damage dealt during one turn?

[I am Pestilence]

Please explain with more details.

1. Why did you remark here about _another_ troop type? What happens when a troop attacks the same troop type?

By another troop type, I simply meant another troop, perhaps I should have made that more clear. or just left "another" out. A better way of saying it would be when any troop type attacks any troop type.

2. And how exactly compute amount of survived units?

10 units have 1000 life total.

After first round units received 400 damage. Still 10 troops remain, but 600 life total? A next turn brings 150 damage. How much units will survive? And most interesting, third turn. If survived 5 units with 450 life total, how to compute result of this last turn? If this turn brings 60 damage whether one unit die or not? Perhaps not cuz total amount of life now is 500 and 450 - 60 still more then half of total life?

Not all questions have concrete answers, it is speculative based off of testing.


3. Which troops will be attacked if more then one troop type stay in the same position under fire? What happens after first turn here:

Snipers (1000).....firing distance.....Snipers (1) + Sigbins (1)

who will die after this turn, all or only one troop type?

You are not giving me enough information to answer this question. Are these defenders? Are they attackers? What troop types are they fighting? BUT, depending on the troop type you sent, or have defending, in most cases the Sigbins would die next. (Not all cases)


4. Move + attack during a turn. Does it matter the amount of remaining speed points after moving on amount of damage dealt during one turn?

Once again, everything about the mechanics are purely speculative. I take test results, analyze them and make an educated guess on what is actually happening, if I can repeat these results numerous times to confirm my theories, then I have solid evidence as to what I think is occurring, is actually occurring. Having said that, I would like to say, just because I add 2+2 and get 4 as the answer, the mechanics could be adding 1+3 to get 4. Meaning, I may be speculating what I think is happening, but what really is happening is totally different, just has the same results.

To address your question, I think that the attack points needed after the movement points have been deducted from the speed varies from troop to troop, it could be a % based thing, it could be a set amount of point, like 250 speed remaining for a Vampire Bat to have a chance to attack. That total could be different for other troop types. Some troop types, like Snipers for example, may need their full speed available for an attack, in other words, if a Sniper has to move, he may not be able to attack too. (NOt saying this is what happens with Snipers, just using them as an example)

My answers in bold

[Protogy]

Well if Flickerforms are sent to spy, they will not start at snipers range, but at their own range which is 0. And, if they are on a spy mission, the only defenders who would fight them is the defending spies. Like a ninja fight. LOL

If you send Flickers on attack mode, then all defenders would come into play like a regular attack.


As for your thoughts on trucks and Armored truck, your suggestion is very plausible, and I had not even considered testing ATs before. I am quite interested in figuring the defense stat out. As I have stated before, it is just my belief, but I have never confirmed nor denied it. This idea may very well help me do one or the other.

Oh right... haha idk why I thought they would start at sniper's range.. I was pretty tired when I wrote that message. That makes a lot more sense with the spies now thanks for clearing that up =P. I am very interested in the AT test since they are my favorite unit (I send resources to allies a lot and when i made the jump from trucks -> armored trucks I almost shit my pants).

[Protogy]

Sorry for double post but it would not let me edit my previous post to add to it

To address your question, I think that the attack points needed after the movement points have been deducted from the speed varies from troop to troop, it could be a % based thing, it could be a set amount of point, like 250 speed remaining for a Vampire Bat to have a chance to attack. That total could be different for other troop types. Some troop types, like Snipers for example, may need their full speed available for an attack, in other words, if a Sniper has to move, he may not be able to attack too. (NOt saying this is what happens with Snipers, just using them as an example)

I don't think it is left over move speed as much as them going from movement phase -> attack phase (my theory is based off your data, not my own). Kinda like you said the order of operations are, if you have grunts and snipers and the snipers are in range of the enemy, the grunts would move forward then the snipers would attack. So with that said, if the bats close the distance to the enemy in movement phase they are probably just switching into attack phase.

There would be two ways this could work, the first would be where you do each phase with each unit (example: phase 1- Slashers move in range of enemy, Snipers stay put, grunts move forward -in order of speed as you speculated-...Phase 2: Slashers attack, snipers attack, grunts do nothing.. phase 3: defender counter attacks.)'
But the second way makes more sense to me, I think it works more like Disgaea or Fire Emblem where each unit does their phases, but this game would pick the units for you since its automated battle so they would go in order of speed. Example:

For the sake of my example being understandable I will clarify that this is not the very first attacking turn since slashers teamed up with snipers would not be able to close the distance in the first turn, that being said the enemy melee units have already moved forward to get closer putting them in front of the enemy snipers (unless they only have grunts or AT).

Attacking turn:
Slashers are the fastest in the example I used so they go first:
Phase 1: Slashers move forward into enemy range
Phase 2: Slashers attack the enemy
Phase 3: Slashers are counter attacked by defender.

Sniper turn:
Phase 1: Snipers don't move since they are already in range
Phase 2: Snipers attack
Phase 3: If Snipers attacked attacked enemy melee nothing happens here, if they attacked enemy Snipers with same level Spectral vision or higher, Gargoyal or Impalers they will be counter attacked.

Grunts:
Phase 1: Move closer
Phase 2-3: Nothing happens.

Defender's Turn:
Same thing as the attacker's phases that i explained but with their units instead.


As for my theory about stats, I agree that to help stabilize the balance of the game defense could be used as the defender's attack strength, but I also think it is the damage that all units (attacking and defending) counter attack with but that is just speculation of what the attacker does with the defense stat (it could also prove why Armored trucks work well to send with your armies, if they counter attack they hit pretty hard).


That is just the theory that I have come up with based on information you have given. It also explains the "left over move speed" hiccup lol. Tell me what you think, I might have missed something you said that makes the theory I have incorrect.

[I am Pestilence]

Well, I can say there are two distinct phases of each round, attackers phase and defenders phase, their is no counter attacks from the other side on the opposing forces turn. Defenders only attack during the defensive phase and attackers only attack during the attack phase. Otherwise if you send say 1 VB and 1 Reaper against a nosferatu, if the nosferatu countered the VB it would squish him, which is not what testing reveals. ALl attacks are handled, if defenders survive, then defenders phase is handled.

And it is not at all like Disgaea or Fire Emblem. It is more like Dragons of Atlantis.

[Protogy]

Well, I can say there are two distinct phases of each round, attackers phase and defenders phase, their is no counter attacks from the other side on the opposing forces turn. Defenders only attack during the defensive phase and attackers only attack during the attack phase. Otherwise if you send say 1 VB and 1 Reaper against a nosferatu, if the nosferatu countered the VB it would squish him, which is not what testing reveals. ALl attacks are handled, if defenders survive, then defenders phase is handled.

And it is not at all like Disgaea or Fire Emblem. It is more like Dragons of Atlantis.

Well I was more comparing the order of operations from Disgaea and Fire Emblem, even if most of what I said has been proven incorrect from the testing you have done I still think there is 2 phases within each player's turn being a movement phase and an attack phase instead of it all being clustered into 1 place, I don't think that extra move speed = attack potential on first encounter, otherwise nosferatus would suck with their 120 speed. If the units had a UI screen during battle instead of imagining 2 bars (HP and Energy bar -both attack and speed-) I imagine 3 bars like (HP, Attack, Speed) where when you move the speed bar goes down and when you attack the attack bar goes down, so if a sniper hits a unit with 60 health it would use 60 / 80 of the attack bar leaving 20 attack to use on someone else. Is this possible?

[I am Pestilence]

Well I was more comparing the order of operations from Disgaea and Fire Emblem, even if most of what I said has been proven incorrect from the testing you have done I still think there is 2 phases within each player's turn being a movement phase and an attack phase instead of it all being clustered into 1 place, I don't think that extra move speed = attack potential on first encounter, otherwise nosferatus would suck with their 120 speed. If the units had a UI screen during battle instead of imagining 2 bars (HP and Energy bar -both attack and speed-) I imagine 3 bars like (HP, Attack, Speed) where when you move the speed bar goes down and when you attack the attack bar goes down, so if a sniper hits a unit with 60 health it would use 60 / 80 of the attack bar leaving 20 attack to use on someone else. Is this possible?

I don't know what else to tell you except it definitely does not work like that. I have enough data to reflect that. If what you are suggesting was the case, some of my tests would have reflected damage from troops that moved into range on their movement phase, and that is not showing at all. There are many instances of a troop that would have moved into range, but did not have enough speed left over and was eliminated on the defensive turn to rule that possibility out.

[beck4040]

I don't know what else to tell you except it definitely does not work like that. I have enough data to reflect that. If what you are suggesting was the case, some of my tests would have reflected damage from troops that moved into range on their movement phase, and that is not showing at all. There are many instances of a troop that would have moved into range, but did not have enough speed left over and was eliminated on the defensive turn to rule that possibility out.

i suppose you could see speed/movement as the quickest and furthest each troop can go before they need to have a sit down and rest lol and hence have no energy left to fight

[I am Pestilence]

i suppose you could see speed/movement as the quickest and furthest each troop can go before they need to have a sit down and rest lol and hence have no energy left to fight

Speed to me is like action points, if they use them all up on moving, they have none left to engage.

[Protogy]

Speed to me is like action points, if they use them all up on moving, they have none left to engage.

Makes sense, that so it would be 2 bars in the example I gave, I was just brainstorming but I only have access to the data that you presented instead of all of your test data, that's why I bring them up =P. There is one thing I am pretty confused about. How you mention damage is spread among the troop type and they don't lose any troops until 50% of their hp is gone, that part confused me. Do you think it is like a sniper shoots a unit and deals 50% dmg to that troop and 50% is spread among the other troops? I think I misunderstood.